Joshua 17:16

Jos 17:16 And the children of Joseph said, The hill is not enough for us: and all the Canaanites that dwell in the land of the valley have chariots of iron, [both they] who [are] of Bethshean and her towns, and [they] who [are] of the valley of Jezreel.

Ver. 16. And the Canaanites … have chariots of iron.] Which were first a terror, and then a scorn, as was before noted out of Vegetius. But where there wanteth a heart, there is never wanting some lion in the way, {Pro 22:13; Pro 26:13} yea, two lions for failing, one in the fields, and another in the streets: so here. The hill is not enough for us, and the Canaanites are too hard for us.

John Trapp, A Commentary or Exposition upon All the Books of the Old and New Testament (1647–1656) — public domain. Text from a community e-Sword module.

Jos 17:16. The hill is not enough for us — That is, if we could get possession of the woody mountain, cut down all its trees, and destroy all its inhabitants, it would not be sufficient for us. But the Hebrew is, The hill will not be found; that is, obtained by us. Those fierce and strong people the Perizzites and the giants will easily defend themselves, and frustrate our attempts, having the advantage of the woods and mountains. The Canaanites that dwell, &c. — They seem to mean that there was another impediment in their way, that before they could come at the mountain to attack it, they would have to encounter those who lived in the valley below it, who were too strong for them. Or that, if Joshua should command them, in case the hill either could not be conquered, or would not be sufficient for them, to go down and take more land out of the pleasant and fruitful valleys, that they would meet with no less difficulty there than in the mountains. Have chariots of iron. — Not all made of iron, but armed with iron, and that not only for defence, but for offence also; having a kind of scythes, of two cubits long, fastened to long axle-trees on both wheels, which being driven swiftly through a body of men, made great slaughter, mowing them down like grass or corn.

Joseph Benson's Commentary on the Old and New Testaments (1811–1818) — public domain. Text from a community e-Sword module.

17:16 As a result of the Canaanites’ iron chariots, Ephraim and Manasseh were restricted to the hill country in the early part of the settlement period (see study note on 11:4). • The valley of Jezreel, a geological interruption of the hill country, separated Lower Galilee to the north from the hill country of Manasseh to the south. The Canaanites living in and near it and the valley of Beth-shan restricted Manasseh’s expansion and apparently Ephraim’s as well. Most of the towns named in 17:11 were on the edges of these valleys.

Tyndale Open Study Notes — © Tyndale Open Resources, licensed CC BY-SA 4.0. Text via the HelloAO Bible API.

chariots of iron--unusually strengthened with that metal, and perhaps armed with projecting scythes.

Next: Joshua Chapter 18

Jamieson, Fausset & Brown — Commentary Critical and Explanatory on the Whole Bible (1871) — public domain (CC PDM 1.0). Text via the HelloAO Bible API.

Verse 16. The hill is not enough for us] The mountain of Gilboa being that which had fallen to them by lot.

Chariots of iron] We cannot possess the plain country, because that is occupied by the Canaanites; and we cannot conquer them, because they have chariots of iron, that is, very strong chariots, and armed with scythes, as is generally supposed.

Adam Clarke's Commentary on the Bible (1810–1826) — public domain. Text from a community e-Sword/MySword module.

16. And the children of Joseph said, etc It is too apparent that they were thinking only of themselves, because they quibble as much as they can, in order to avoid following the suggestion of Joshua, than which, however, nothing was more reasonable. They object, that the mountain is rugged and little better than a desert, and therefore, though it were added to them, they would derive very little benefit from it. In regard to the plain, which was cultivated and fertile, they object that they are shut out and debarred from it because of the formidable array of the enemy. Accordingly, they make mention of their iron chariots, as if they had not already learned by experience that the Lord was able, without any difficulty, to trample down both horses and chariots. Joshua, however, by a simple and right-hearted answer, administers due castigation, as well to their avarice as their effeminacy and torpor. If the forest, as it now stands, is not sufficiently productive, cut down the trees and convert it into good fields; provided you are not sparing of your labor, you will have no reason to be dissatisfied with your habitation. Iron chariots, moreover, cannot prevent the Lord from performing what he has promised to you. The inheritance is yours; do only your part by entering with due confidence on the possession of it.

John Calvin's Commentaries (1540-1563) — public domain. Text from the Calvin Translation Society English edition (1840s-50s) via the Christian Classics Ethereal Library (ccel.org). Calvin's coverage is partial (roughly two-thirds of the Bible); uncommented books and verses are honest gaps, never fabricated. The 19th-century editor's footnotes and remarks are omitted so the notes are faithfully Calvin's own voice.

16. have chariots of iron] The iron chariots of the Canaanites were objects of terror to the Israelites, see above, ch. Jos_11:6-9. They were the main reason why the Israelites could not establish themselves in the plain, on which Beth-shean, Taanach, and Megiddo were situated. The forest they could occupy, but the plain, where the “chariot-cavalry” of their foes were so effective though powerless in the mountains, they could not reduce. Comp. Jdg_1:19; Jdg_4:3; 1Sa_13:5. Compare as to the insecurity of the plains the remarks of Tristram: “No matter how wide, how rich, how well cultivated a plain may be, like Acre or Esdraelon, its tame monotony is never relieved by a single village. These are all hidden in the nooks of the mountains; for no fellâhin or cultivators would venture to dwell where any night they might be harried by a party of Bedouin troopers, and to this risk they gladly prefer an hour or two’s weary climb added to their daily toil: while no traveller would dream of encamping even for a night in the open plain.” Land of Israel, p. 421.

the valley] As the “hill” here denotes Mount Ephraim, so the valley country includes both (a) the valley or ghôr of the Jordan near Bethshean, and (b) the wide plain of Jezreel, between Gilboa and little Hermon, to which, in its widest extent, the name of Esdraelon has been applied in modern times; a name first used in Jdt_1:8. “It was only this plain of Jezreel, and that north of Lake Huleh, that was then accessible to the chariots of the Canaanites. It was in this plain of Jezreel that Joram king of Israel and Ahaziah king of Judah went forth in chariots to meet the enemy (2Ki_9:21). It was here that Jehu passed in a chariot to Samaria, to meet the faithful Jehonadab (2Ki_10:15). And Wilson (Lands of the Bible, ii. 303), in leaving the hilly district of Judæa, wholly unfitted for vehicles, and entering the plain of Esdraelon at Jenin, was surprised to see how entirely it differed from the country which he had previously traversed, and how easily it might be crossed by excellent highways, if the custom of the country admitted of the use of vehicles. In the days of the Jews, the plain was so associated with the use of the chariot, that this term became to a certain extent an exponent of the power of the people inhabiting the plain. The chariot was the glory of Ephraim, as the horse was of Judah (Zec_9:9-10). Carl Ritter’s Geography of Palestine, ii. 327, 328.

The Cambridge Bible for Schools and Colleges (gen. ed. J. J. S. Perowne; Cambridge University Press, 1878–1918) — public domain. Text from a community e-Sword module.

And the children of Joseph said, the hill is not enough for us,.... Meaning either Mount Ephraim, and all included in it; or it may be rather the wood country on the hills and mountains they were bid to go up to; signifying, that if they could gain that out of the hands of the Perizzites and giants, and clear it of the wood, and make it habitable, even that would not be sufficient for them; or that hill and mountain cannot be "found by us" (r) or obtained and possessed by us; we are not able to get it into our hands; there being a valley between us and that:

and all the Canaanites that dwell in the land of the valley have chariots of iron; not chariots made of iron, but chariots with iron scythes fastened to the sides, or axle trees of them, which when driven with great force and fury, would cut down the infantry in battle, as grass is cut down with scythes, see Jdg 4:2,

both they who are of Bethshean and her towns, and they who are of the valley of Jezreel; both which belonged to the tribe of Manasseh, or were on the borders of it, though as yet they had not got possession, see Jos 17:11; and this circumstance seems to favour the notion, that tribe of Manasseh were at least chiefly concerned in this address.

(r) "non invenietur nobis", Montanus; "non possumus montem istum assequi", Tigurine version; "non obtinebitur a nobis", Masius.

John Gill's Exposition of the Whole Bible (1746–1763) — public domain (CC PDM 1.0). Text via the HelloAO Bible API.

The possession by the Canaanites of chariots strengthened and tipped with iron, such as were used by the Egyptians Exo 14:7, is named here by the children of Joseph as a reason why they could not possess themselves of the plains. “The valley of Jezreel” is the broad low valley which sweeps from “Zerin” between the mountains of Gilboa and the range of little Hermon eastward down to the Jordan. It was most likely in this valley that the host of the Midianites was encamped, when attacked by Gideon Jdg 7:1, Jdg 7:8. The great plain of Jezreel, called the plain of Esdraelon (Esdrelom, Judith 1:8), extends from Carmel on the west to the hills of Gilboa, little Hermon, and Tabor on the east, a distance of full sixteen miles; and its breadth between the rocky mass of southern Palestine and the bolder mountains of Galilee on the north, is about twelve miles. Its position as well as its open area make it the natural battlefield of Palestine.

Albert Barnes' Notes on the Bible (1834–1885) — public domain. Text from a community e-Sword/MySword module.

Thee. Destroy the Pherezite, &c., (Menochius) take their cities, and destroy the inhabitants, like so many trees, or cut down the wood to build houses, and in order to cultivate the land for the production of corn and grass.

George Leo Haydock (1774–1849), Haydock's Catholic Family Bible and Commentary, 1859 edition — public domain. Excludes Psalms (Douay-Rheims chapter numbering differs from Protestant) and Deuterocanonical books (Catholic canon only).

The hill is not enough for us; if we should invade and conquer it, and cut down both wood and men, yet it would not be sufficient for us. Heb. The hill will not be found, i.e. obtained, by us; those fierce and strong people the Perizzites and the giants will easily defend themselves, and frustrate our attempts, having the advantage of the woods and mountains.

The Canaanites that dwell in the land of the valley, i.e. And if thou sayest, as we know thou wilt reply, that if the hill either cannot be conquered, or be not sufficient for us, we may go down and take more land out of the pleasant and fruitful valleys, we shall meet with no less difficulty there than in the mountains. Or thus, In going to the hills to which thou directest us, we must pass through valleys, where we shall be waylaid by powerful and armed enemies.

Chariots of iron; not all made of iron but armed with iron, not only for defence, but for offence also, having as it were scythes and swords fastened to them, to cut down all that stood in their way.

The valley of Jezreel; which was either in the tribe of Issachar, or upon the borders of it, Jos 19:18.

Matthew Poole's English Annotations on the Holy Bible (1683–1685) — public domain. Text from a community e-Sword/MySword module.

16. The hill is not enough — And yet they wanted more hill. They did not wish to go into the valleys.

Chariots of iron — Strengthened with iron, and possibly armed with scythes. The timidity and lack of trust in Jehovah evinced by these Josephites is most clearly seen when viewed in the light of the specific command and promise of God: “When thou goest out to battle against thine enemies, and seest horses and chariots and a people more than thou, be not afraid of them, for the Lord thy God is with thee.” Deu_20:1.

Beth-shean — Jos_17:11.

[The valley of Jezreel — That noble and beautiful plain, the richest and most celebrated in Palestine, called in its Greek form Esdraelon, and associated with many of the most famous events of sacred and of common history. It has the form of a triangle, whose base runs fifteen miles southwesterly from the foot of Mount Tabor, and whose southwest side sweeps along the base of Mount Carmel to the Mediterranean Sea. The sons of Joseph were afraid to cope with the inhabitants of this valley, and wanted more territory among the hills. The valley of Jezreel was, strictly speaking, the eastern branch of Esdraelon, running towards the Jordan along the Wady Jalud.]

Daniel D. Whedon (gen. ed.), Commentary on the Old and New Testaments (1874–1909) — public domain. Text from a community e-Sword module.

And the children of Joseph said. This reply justifies Joshua"s sarcasm. The Ephraimites and Manassites blame Joshua when they ought to be blaming themselves. They excuse themselves from a task which they are too idle to execute, and wish Joshua to make arrangements for them which are wholly unnecessary. The hill is not enough for us. Literally, the hill is not found for us that is, is not sufficient. (see Num_11:9:2 Zec_10:10) Of the valley of Jezreel. Rather, in the valley of Jezreel. The word for valley in this verse is qm (see note on Jos_8:13). Jezreel abutted on the great plain of Esdraelon, a name which is but a corruption of Jezreel, (see note on Jos_19:18) where the chariots of iron could be used with effect, a thing impossible in the mountain districts. Hence the fact that the hill country of Palestine was more rapidly and permanently occupied than the plains. (see Ewald, "History," 22 C., and Ritter"s "Geography of Palestine," 2:328. Cf. Jud_1:19, and note on Jos_11:6) Here, once more, we have a proof that we have real history before us, and not a collection of poetic myths.

The Pulpit Commentary (1880–1919), ed. H.D.M. Spence-Jones & Joseph S. Exell — public domain. Text from a community e-Sword module.

Is not enough - Hebrew. the hill will not be found, that is, obtained by us; those fierce and strong people the Perizzites and the giants will easily defend themselves, and frustrate our attempts, having the advantage of the woods and mountains. The Canaanites that dwell - That is, and if thou sayest, that if the hill either cannot be conquered, or is not sufficient for us, we may go down and take more land out of the pleasant and fruitful valleys, we shall meet with no less difficulty there than in the mountains. Chariots of iron - Not all made of iron, but armed with iron, not only for defense, but for offense also, having as it were scythes and swords fastened to them, to cut down all that stood in their way.

John Wesley, Explanatory Notes Upon the Whole Bible (1754–1765) — public domain. Text via the GEBible commentary corpus.

Beth Shan ... Jezreel

These are the names of places. (See: How to Translate Names)

the house of Joseph

Here the word "house" refers to the descendants. AT: "the descendants of Joseph" (See: Metonymy)

you will clear it

"you will clear the forest of trees" or "you will cut down its trees"

translationWords

chariot

power

cast out

unfoldingWord translationNotes — © Distant Shores Media and the Door43 World Missions Community, licensed CC BY-SA 4.0. Source: git.door43.org/Door43/en_tn.

The mountain will not be sufficient for us. For it is too crowded for us as you [just] said.

It will not be sufficient. It will not be enough.

Iron chariots. ‘And that what you say, go up to the forest and conquer the land of the Perezzites and the Rephaim [is not so simple] because the Canaanites are a mighty people, and they possess iron chariots.’ Do not wonder if Scripture refers to the Perezzites and Rephaim as Canaanites for they were all descendants of the original Canaan.

Rashi on the Tanakh — English translations: “The Judaica Press complete Tanach with Rashi, translated by A. J. Rosenberg” (CC BY 4.0); “Pentateuch with Rashi's commentary by M. Rosenbaum and A.M. Silbermann, 1929-1934” (public domain); “The Metsudah Tanach series, Lakewood, N.J” (CC BY 4.0); and “The Book of Joshua, Metsudah Publications, 1997” (CC BY 4.0). Text via Sefaria.